What would be a good GPS for either a multi-day adventure race or extended fast-packing?  The main functions I'm looking for, off the top of my head, are: 1) continuous recording of as much data as possible for later downloading 2) good real-time displays including dist traveled, speed, long/lat 3) long battery life and ability to swap batteries since no recharge would be possible 4) waypoints for establishing various food caches 5) as small and light as possible Something like an emergency signal to a satellite ability would be a plus. I'm thinking anything with a map display would be too large or consume too much battery, but not sure about this. Just starting to look, so any ideas or sites to check things out would be helpful. Thanks. -Tony

What would be a good GPS for either a multi-day adventure race or extended fast-packing?  The main functions I'm looking for, off the top of my head, are: 1) continuous recording of as much data as possible for later downloading 2) good real-time displays including dist traveled, speed, long/lat 3) long battery life and ability to swap batteries since no recharge would be possible 4) waypoints for establishing various food caches 5) as small and light as possible Something like an emergency signal to a satellite ability would be a plus. I'm thinking anything with a map display would be too large or consume too much battery, but not sure about this. Just starting to look, so any ideas or sites to check things out would be helpful. Thanks. -Tony Be sure you get something with a newer chip (in Garmin, it's the Sirf chip). Yes, there's a world of difference in reception. The newer ones have trouble with bounces off canyon walls, but that's minor compared with improved reception beneath closed canopies. Wet canopies, poor sky visibility, and poor satellite configurations are inherent in the technology. I haven't compared models recently, but a few years ago, sometimes the full color displays had longer battery lives than the monochrome - because the technology was newer and more energy efficient. So you can't always judge battery life by how much the screen displays. I really like my GPSmap 60CSx. https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?cID=145&pID=310 I don't care about looking at things while I'm running, so it rides in my pack when I'm running. If I'm doing trail work, it's more handy. I believe it can handle Garmin maps, but most of the areas I run in aren't well mapped or are rolling steep hills where anything being slightly off might show you at bottom of hill rather than on ridge. Plus 70 ft hills don't always show up on 100-ft contour maps. So I never bothered putting maps in it, which are another cost. That way I'm not bothered by extraneous lines. People using them on long trips would definitely benefit. Major trips get downloaded into TopoFusion, which has more analysis capabilities than most of the garmin software, but I don't think it's convenient to use for daily runs. The guys that wrote it are cyclists, and into trail mapping. I kinda like supporting the private entrepreneurs rather than big companies if they provide something that works at least as well. The etrex series has since updated their chips and are probably better than what they were. I prefer the buttons on the 60csx rather than the etrex setup, but that's me, and the larger size is a small cost for *me*. The wrist-mounted Foretrex (precursor to ForeRunner) has old chips, so avoid. https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?cID=145&pID=8703 I think both of the above models can handle about 10,000 track points. Not sure if the memory cards in the 60csx are for tracks or to include maps, which I haven't bothered with. I listed the high end models since that's where the newer updates occur first. Not sure if the simpler models were updated or not. You can handle more time, by decreasing the frequency of recording. I think both use regular batteries. I know the 60 uses 2 AA, and lithiums work great - maybe 30 hours, but I never remember to keep track of when I put the batteries in so lose track after a few weeks. I know I use it 13 hrs straight at RP, and probably 10-20 hrs after that. The running ForeRunner series were designed for shorter runs and not as a real gps. I've tried using waypoints with them and found them extremely cumbersome. It's rechargeable, and some folks have used cellphone rechargers to charge during a run (see ultra list), but doubt they're on multidays. Also, the Etrex and 60csx listed above have barometric altimeters so you get better hill data. The Edge is the bike equivalent of FR and it does have the altimeter in it. It's form factor is like the Etrex, but I think might have rechargeable batteries. Regarding emergencies, you might consider cell phone with gps capabilities. I think most current generation phones have that for 911 calls. Some may have a sub_script_ion service for non-911 calls. Some people are using Spot to allow others to track them, and it has the ability to send out limited help messages that aren't 911, plus 911 capabilities, I think. Some people just make the info available to their loved ones, others make it public. While it's fun to watch some of these folks progress, it's also a major headache for RD's, if they weren't clued in on protocols ahead of time. In a recent race, one guy made his page public but had pre-arranged protocols with his wife or friends, that help meant he was bagging the race and just progressing to the nearest checkpoint to drop or be evacuated. It was not life threatening. Well, the general public saw the help, and contacted the RD who had no idea what the help really meant. That particular race is a wilderness race designed for those that can take care of themselves. It's inconsistent having these issues. The guy was hobbling along, and a snow machiner did provide a lift to a checkpoint, iirc, but he had been located where they couldn't get a plane in anyway. (BTW, racers in that race post a rescue bond before departure. Shorter races may require a credit card imprint that will be used for rescue fees, if needed, otherwise no charges). Search on spot to get to the electronics discussion. http://tinyurl.com/dyn4s9 The flip side of that is that the Iditarod required gps trackers on all sleds (or maybe musher) this year - and for a fee you could follow the mushers along the trail. When one guy's gps signal didn't move for awhile or was moving very slowly (1/2 mph or something along those lines), his wife contacted Iditarod officials. He was in trouble, and was rescued, but not before he lost 2 of his dogs. Just a few things to think about. Dot

Tony S. < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message | What would be a good GPS for either a multi-day adventure race or | extended fast-packing?  The main functions I'm looking for, off the top | of my head, are: | | 1) continuous recording of as much data as possible for later | downloading what is the total duration you are looking for? My Garming Forerunner 305 can go on for 10+ hours between full recharges. That is good for more than a week of running. (I think my backup 205 does that too, but haven't verified) | 2) good real-time displays including dist traveled, speed, long/lat Both 305/205 models have them | 3) long battery life and ability to swap batteries since no recharge | would be possible You can get a solar charger if you don't have access to electricity in a building and don't have car with you. You would be carrying bigger devices if they have swappable batteries. | 4) waypoints for establishing various food caches I haven't explored but 205/305 have some kind of tracking, probably not what you are looking for anyway. Sounds like you are looking for some kind of device for hiking and Dot's _link_ would be more useful. | 5) as small and light as possible How small? 405 model is the latest and smallest for running and is size of a wrist watch. 205/305 are bigger, but still reasonable. | Something like an emergency signal to a satellite ability would be a | plus. I'm thinking anything with a map display would be too large or | consume too much battery, but not sure about this. Just starting to | look, so any ideas or sites to check things out would be helpful. | Thanks. I do the mapping part after the runs and Training Center software is OK for the most part. But runningahead.com has online upload and integrated with google maps. These are way much better than  the Training Center software. Probably your cell phone would be most useful for emergency use.

(BTW, racers in that race post a rescue bond before departure. Shorter races may require a credit card imprint that will be used for rescue fees, if needed, otherwise no charges).     At the Solstice run, you could buy 'insurance cards' from the local EMT booth, otherwise you'd be liable for extrication costs, well worth $3 or whatever it was. rms

I believe it can handle Garmin maps, but most of the areas I run in aren't well mapped or are rolling steep hills where anything being slightly off might show you at bottom of hill rather than on ridge. Plus 70 ft hills don't always show up on 100-ft contour maps. So I never bothered putting maps in it, which are another cost. That way I'm not bothered by extraneous lines. People using them on long trips would definitely benefit. It definitely takes Garmin maps, and you can even roll your own for free if you're motivated enough to do so: http://home.roadrunner.com/~creek/garmin.htm gives a pretty good tutorial for how to do it, although I use a slightly different process to get the contour lines than he does. I do this especially if I can get hold of good trail data from some local source like a county GIS department, park service, or the USFS, all of which is free data.  Doing it this way gives you way more detailed and current maps than you could buy from Garmin, but takes a fair amount of up-front work.  Worth while if going into some serious wilderness areas.  I always do this before a backcountry ski trip